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Carolyn Smith |
How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?
(And other foolish questions...)
I am not a Bible scholar by any means, so bear with me. I understand the definition of fornication (sex between unmarried folks), which means pretty much no marriage would fall under Biblical grounds today.
But according to Strongs, the word for fornication is defined as follows:
illicit sexual intercourse
adultery, fornication, homosexuality, lesbianism, intercourse with
animals, etc.
sexual intercourse with close relatives; Lev. 18
sexual intercourse with a divorced man or woman; Mk. 10:11,
metaph. the worship of idols
of the defilement of idolatry, as incurred by eating the sacrifices
offered to idols
Furthermore, the Bible doesn't really give women ANY grounds for divorce, does it?
Hmmm...was this thread about divorce?
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Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5923
6/20/13 10:49 pm
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| Re: Should porn be a "deal breaker" in marriage? |
JLA777 |
| bonnie knox wrote: | Offshoot from another thread. I'm speaking of marriages in which both spouses claim to be Christians.
Is porn acceptable in a Christian marriage? If not, how should it be dealt with? Does it make a difference if the person involved in the porn is willing or unwilling to work at overcoming the addiction?
I really don't like the angle of working from a negative, i.e., how much bad stuff can be tolerated in a marriage rather than from the positive, i.e., what should a godly marriage look like. However, I want to address this because I have the feeling that if people are saying porn is a "deal breaker," that sentiment is borne more of a reaction against porn than from an advocacy of divorce. |
I don't feel it's acceptable in any marriage, nor outside of marriage!
But with that said, I can't say I believe it's a reason for divorce, but I could see where it could lead to some serious problems within the marriage. I feel it would make a huge difference if there was a willingness to overcome the addiction, the couple could work on it together, even if only one of them had the addiction. I know "marriage is good in all things and a bed undefiled" and I am certainly no prude, but there is absolutely nothing good that can come out of pornography; period.
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Joany
May the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen! Philemon 1:25
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Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2624
6/21/13 11:22 am
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Clint Wills |
| Quiet Wyatt wrote: | Lets boil it down even further. Say a man loves his wife, but for whatever reason, his wife is not receptive to him sexually for weeks and months at a time. Not just an occasional headache, but let's say they may be together sexually only once every few months, and even when they are, he can tell it's something his wife sees as a chore rather than a mutual pleasure.
As a result of this, the husband finds himself having sexual fantasies about his old girlfriend who was far more receptive than his wife. He tries to stay true to his wife in his heart, but finds his sexual needs often overwhelming. He never looks at porn and never actually has an affair involving actual physical sex with another woman, but his mind is almost constantly bombarded by the temptation to fantasize about what used to be and what could be if he let himself to follow through on his fantasies.
Does his wife have grounds for divorce, since he has committed adultery in his heart?
(For the sake of argument, let's leave off for now discussing the wife's guilt in not fulfilling her marital obligations and just focus on the husband's responsibility). |
You've described (in essence) every man to ever walk the earth - possibly aside from Jesus. You are talking about the TEMPTATION to fantasize. As far as us men having a sexual "need" lets be honest - there is no physiological NEED for sex...sorry, as much as we'd like to tell our wives that, it's not true. It may feel like a need, and lack of it may even cause us to not think straight, but there is no physiological need for sex.
I would also say to that, we can never EVER blame the wife for the husband's sin. I'm not sure if you're doing that here not not. The wife may be making her own mistakes, but his sin is his choice alone - not her's. This is like saying "if the wife doesn't submit, then I understand why he doesn't love"...stupid. We control ourselves...this is why SELF-control is a fruit of the Spirit.
Again, like I said in my last post...the defenders of porn (for lack of a better term) are looking at this the wrong way. To the question "is it a deal breaker" I honestly don't know - I think that would be a case-by-case call. I would certainly have a hard time forcing a woman to remain with a dude that is constantly looking at porn and spitting in her face to do it. If someone came to me for counsel, I will always do whatever I can to repair a marriage. But the idea that the only thing that God makes allowance for is intercourse is foolishness. That is a teenage "I don't want to cross the imaginary 'sex' line" type of thinking. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5161
6/23/13 2:10 am
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Quiet Wyatt |
| Clint Wills wrote: | | Quiet Wyatt wrote: | Lets boil it down even further. Say a man loves his wife, but for whatever reason, his wife is not receptive to him sexually for weeks and months at a time. Not just an occasional headache, but let's say they may be together sexually only once every few months, and even when they are, he can tell it's something his wife sees as a chore rather than a mutual pleasure.
As a result of this, the husband finds himself having sexual fantasies about his old girlfriend who was far more receptive than his wife. He tries to stay true to his wife in his heart, but finds his sexual needs often overwhelming. He never looks at porn and never actually has an affair involving actual physical sex with another woman, but his mind is almost constantly bombarded by the temptation to fantasize about what used to be and what could be if he let himself to follow through on his fantasies.
Does his wife have grounds for divorce, since he has committed adultery in his heart?
(For the sake of argument, let's leave off for now discussing the wife's guilt in not fulfilling her marital obligations and just focus on the husband's responsibility). |
You've described (in essence) every man to ever walk the earth - possibly aside from Jesus. |
Wow. I certainly hope not.
| Quote: |
You are talking about the TEMPTATION to fantasize. |
I'm referring more to thoughts that come from one's own self, impulses, desires, etc., which are made far worse when the marriage bed is not as frequent as it should be.
| Quote: | | As far as us men having a sexual "need" lets be honest - there is no physiological NEED for sex...sorry, as much as we'd like to tell our wives that, it's not true. It may feel like a need, and lack of it may even cause us to not think straight, but there is no physiological need for sex. |
Sex is just as truly a need (for men at least) as eating and sleeping. You can go without it for a while, but there will always be negative effects from such deprivation. How else has this world been populated, if not for the male sex drive?
| Quote: |
I would also say to that, we can never EVER blame the wife for the husband's sin. I'm not sure if you're doing that here not not. |
Like I said, I am not dealing with the wife's guilt in this scenario. I am also not referring to external temptations. I am referring to the natural sex drive of a man with a testosterone level in the normal range, which, when not satisfied over weeks and months, becomes more and more overwhelming. I am NOT saying a man loses all control of himself. I am saying that expecting a man whose wife basically never fulfills her marital duty in this regard to never have a lustful thought, or to never fantasize, is simply silly.
And yet according to the reasoning it seems you are advocating, if a man basically rarely ever receives sexual love from his wife and begins to have sexual fantasies, his wife has grounds to divorce him over it, since looking with lust is adultery in the heart, since desiring that one could have an affair is just as much adultery as actually physically committing adultery. I believe that position to be unscriptural, unreal, and truly absurd.
But because of the temptation to sexual immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman her own husband. The husband should give to his wife her conjugal rights, and likewise the wife to her husband. For the wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. Likewise the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does. Do not deprive one another, except perhaps by agreement for a limited time, that you may devote yourselves to prayer; but then come together again, so that Satan may not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. 1 Cor 7:2-5 ESV
(Also, I don't know what you mean by forcing a woman to stay with a man who was looking at porn. There is basically no way in this day and age to force anyone to stay in a marriage, even if you wanted to). |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12817
6/23/13 3:27 am
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