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 Can someone actively |
Ernie Long |
be doing any of the following and be a Christian?
Look at porn
Drink to relax
Cheat on their spouse
Cheat on their taxes
Take a few small office supplies from work
Lie to save face
Go to a strip club
Smoke a little dope for their pain
Snort a little powder to escape reality for a little while
Cuss
Refuse to work
Over eat everyday
Are any of these sins or are they faults? |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1050
11/28/16 11:08 am
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c6thplayer1 |
| Quote: | | Are any of these sins or are they faults? |
They are both. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
11/28/16 11:40 am
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Ernie Long |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: | | Quote: | | Are any of these sins or are they faults? |
They are both. |
What about the first question? |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1050
11/28/16 1:01 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
| I would say yes but they would be a poor Christian. Christianity isn't about rules and regulations to follow. It is about a relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ. If your relationship is strong then you would not want to do any of the things you mentioned. Im not sure where the line of no return exist. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
11/28/16 2:07 pm
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| Re: Can someone actively |
Link |
You'd need to explain a bit about 'drink to relax' to make it a sin. How about relaxing with a cup of coffee, is that a sin? Why would it be wrong to do the same thing with one cup of win? How about a low alcohol beer?
When Jesus drank wine, did He ever relax a bit? What about the apostles? They weren't standing up at the Lord's Supper.
There are times it is appropriate to refuse to work. There is a Proverb against working too much too.
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Link |
Acts-perienced Poster
Posts: 11849
11/28/16 7:09 pm
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Cojak |
Cheat on their spouse!
This would be pretty hard to do and it not be a sin, since it is listed as a SIN in scripture, That would be adultery, I think.
I really do not like lists. If we all made a list of the top 10 things GOD looks at as sin, we might have many different lists with about 4 being common. Just a guess.
If a Dr. Prescribes Valium most Christians would take it. If a Dr. Prescribes marijuana for pain, SOME Christians would use it.
If a Dr. prescribes a glass of wine before bed time, many Christians would follow the 'script'.
Lists get shaky. If you compare a list from 1952 and 2016 you would see a drastic change. Did God change? A list from 1952 would have been drastically different. It would contain TV, Movies, jewelry, make-up and bobbed hair at the top. 
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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Posts: 24285
11/28/16 8:16 pm
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| Just sayin' |
Steve Norris |
| God's Word says that if we are guilty of one, we are guilty of all. Most of us have our individual soap boxes on topics that set us off... It has been suggested that gossip is by scripture put into the same class of sin as sins of a sexual nature... So many in the Church are lukewarm... hot about some things yet cold about others, the mix of which make them lukewarm and at the same time, sickening to the Lord... We are quick to speak against homosexuality... alcohol... yet how many of us are on the phone the next day to gossip... I suspect that, as the Bible says, many will argue with the Lord saying, "Lord, look at all we've done in your name!" To which Jesus will respond, "Depart from me... I never knew you..." |
Hey, DOC
Posts: 69
11/29/16 12:28 pm
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| I don't like list either |
Ernie Long |
But, I have seen all of these in the churches I have attended or pastored and the ones who commit these things say they have no need to ask the Lord for forgiveness, because they aren't spiritual issues.
I think too many take their salvation too lightly, but maybe they know something I don't. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1050
11/29/16 1:45 pm
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| Re: Can someone actively |
Ernie Long |
| Link wrote: | You'd need to explain a bit about 'drink to relax' to make it a sin. How about relaxing with a cup of coffee, is that a sin? Why would it be wrong to do the same thing with one cup of win? How about a low alcohol beer?
When Jesus drank wine, did He ever relax a bit? What about the apostles? They weren't standing up at the Lord's Supper.
There are times it is appropriate to refuse to work. There is a Proverb against working too much too. |
Hey Link, if you need liquor to relax, more power to you. Do you know for a fact that Jesus drank wine to relax? I only read where they drank wine with their meals, for an upset stomach, and while they was partying, but I'm sure someone has wrote somewhere that Jesus drank wine while cruising the seas, cause He was telling them, "Let's go over to the other side" quite often.  |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1050
11/29/16 1:53 pm
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| Re: Can someone actively |
wayne |
| Link wrote: | You'd need to explain a bit about 'drink to relax' to make it a sin. How about relaxing with a cup of coffee, is that a sin? Why would it be wrong to do the same thing with one cup of win? How about a low alcohol beer?
When Jesus drank wine, did He ever relax a bit? What about the apostles? They weren't standing up at the Lord's Supper.
There are times it is appropriate to refuse to work. There is a Proverb against working too much too. |
Link: I will try to find stats on Coffee and working too much.
Alcohol Facts and Statistics
Alcohol Use in the United States:
• Prevalence of Drinking: In 2014, 87.6 percent of people ages 18 or older reported that they drank alcohol at some point in their lifetime; 71.0 percent reported that they drank in the past year; 56.9 percent reported that they drank in the past month.1
• Prevalence of Binge Drinking and Heavy Drinking: In 2014, 24.7 percent of people ages 18 or older reported that they engaged in binge drinking in the past month; 6.7 percent reported that they engaged in heavy drinking in the past month.2
Alcohol Use Disorder (AUD) in the United States:
• Adults (ages 18+): 16.3 million adults ages 18 and older3 (6.8 percent of this age group4) had an AUD in 2014. This includes 10.6 million men3 (9.2 percent of men in this age group4) and 5.7 million women3 (4.6 percent of women in this age group4). • About 1.5 million adults received treatment for an AUD at a specialized facility in 2014 (8.9 percent of adults who needed treatment)5. This included 1.1 million men (9.8 percent of men in need) and 431,000 women (7.4 percent of women who needed treatment)5.
• Youth (ages 12–17): In 2014, an estimated 679,000 adolescents ages 12–176 (2.7 percent of this age group7) had an AUD. This number includes 367,000 females6 (3.0 percent of females in this age group7) and 311,000 males6 (2.5 percent of males in this age group7). • An estimated 55,000 adolescents (18,000 males and 37,000 females) received treatment for an alcohol problem in a specialized facility in 2014.8
Alcohol-Related Deaths:
• Nearly 88,0009 people (approximately 62,000 men and 26,000 women9) die from alcohol-related causes annually, making alcohol the fourth leading preventable cause of death in the United States.10
• In 2014, alcohol-impaired driving fatalities accounted for 9,967 deaths (31 percent of overall driving fatalities).11
Economic Burden:
• In 2010, alcohol misuse problems cost the United States $249.0 billion.12
• Three-quarters of the total cost of alcohol misuse is related to binge drinking.12
Global Burden:
• In 2012, 3.3 million deaths, or 5.9 percent of all global deaths (7.6 percent for men and 4.0 percent for women), were attributable to alcohol consumption.13
• Alcohol contributes to over 200 diseases and injury-related health conditions, most notably alcohol dependence, liver cirrhosis, cancers, and injuries.14 In 2012, 5.1 percent of the burden of disease and injury worldwide (139 million disability-adjusted life-years) was attributable to alcohol consumption.13
• Globally, alcohol misuse is the fifth leading risk factor for premature death and disability; among people between the ages of 15 and 49, it is the first.15 In the age group 20–39 years, approximately 25 percent of the total deaths are alcohol attributable.16
Family Consequences:
• More than 10 percent of U.S. children live with a parent with alcohol problems, according to a 2012 study.17
Underage Drinking:
• Prevalence of Underage Alcohol Use: • Prevalence of Drinking: According to the 2014 National Survey on Drug Use and Health (NSDUH), 34.7 percent of 15-year-olds report that they have had at least 1 drink in their lives.18 About 8.7 million people ages 12–2019 (22.8 percent of this age group20) reported drinking alcohol in the past month (23 percent of males and 22.5 percent of females21).
• Prevalence of Binge Drinking: According to the 2014 NSDUH, approximately 5.3 million people22 (about 13.8 percent20) ages 12–20 were binge drinkers (15.8 percent of males and 12.4 percent of females21).
• Prevalence of Heavy Drinking: According to the 2014 NSDUH, approximately 1.3 million people22 (about 3.4 percent20) ages 12–20 were heavy drinkers (4.6 percent of males and 2.7 percent of females21).
• Consequences of Underage Alcohol Use: • Research indicates that alcohol use during the teenage years could interfere with normal adolescent brain development and increase the risk of developing an AUD. In addition, underage drinking contributes to a range of acute consequences, including injuries, sexual assaults, and even deaths—including those from car crashes.23
Alcohol and College Students:
• Prevalence of Alcohol Use: • Prevalence of Drinking: In 2014, 59.8 percent of full-time college students ages 18–22 drank alcohol in the past month compared with 51.5 percent of other persons of the same age.24
• Prevalence of Binge Drinking: In 2014, 37.9 percent of college students ages 18–22 engaged in binge drinking (5 or more drinks on an occasion) in the past month compared with 33.5 percent of other persons of the same age.25
• Prevalence of Heavy Drinking: In 2014, 12.2 percent of college students ages 18–22 engaged in heavy drinking (5 or more drinks on an occasion on 5 or more occasions per month) in the past month compared with 9.5 percent of other persons of the same age.26
• Consequences—Researchers estimate that each year: • 1,825 college students between the ages of 18 and 24 die from alcohol-related unintentional injuries, including motor-vehicle crashes.27
• 696,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 are assaulted by another student who has been drinking.28
• 97,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 report experiencing alcohol-related sexual assault or date rape.28
• Roughly 20 percent of college students meet the criteria for an AUD.29
• About 1 in 4 college students report academic consequences from drinking, including missing class, falling behind in class, doing poorly on exams or papers, and receiving lower grades overall.30
Alcohol and Pregnancy:
• The prevalence of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (FAS) in the United States was estimated by the Institute of Medicine in 1996 to be between 0.5 and 3.0 cases per 1,000.31
• More recent reports from specific U.S. sites report the prevalence of FAS to be 2 to 7 cases per 1,000,31 and the prevalence of Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorders (FASD) to be as high as 20 to 50 cases per 1,000.32,33
Alcohol and the Human Body:
• In 2013, of the 72,559 liver disease deaths among individuals aged 12 and older, 45.8 percent involved alcohol. Among males, 48.5 percent of the 46,568 liver disease deaths involved alcohol. Among females, 41.8 percent of the 25,991 liver disease deaths involved alcohol.34
• Among all cirrhosis deaths in 2011, 48.0 percent were alcohol related. The proportion of alcohol-related cirrhosis was highest (72.7 percent) among decedents ages 25–34, followed by decedents aged 35–44, at 70.3 percent.35
• In 2009, alcohol-related liver disease was the primary cause of almost 1 in 3 liver transplants in the United States.36
• Drinking alcohol increases the risk of cancers of the mouth, esophagus, pharynx, larynx, liver, and breast.37 |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1274
11/29/16 2:04 pm
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Randy Johnson |
We are called to be led by the Holy Spirit and not by our flesh.
People who do those things Ernie listed are being led by their flesh, and if they do not by the Spirit put to death the misdeeds of the body, they will die.
_________________
Randy Johnson, Pastor
Ickesburg Church of God
85 Tuscarora Path
Ickesburg, Pennsylvania |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5431
11/29/16 5:59 pm
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| Re: Can someone actively |
Cojak |
| Ernie Long wrote: |
Hey Link, if you need liquor to relax, more power to you. Do you know for a fact that Jesus drank wine to relax? I only read where they drank wine with their meals, for an upset stomach, and while they was partying,.... |
Link simply asked for more explanation, I did not read that he drank to relax.
As far as the Lord drinking wine. It is a simple fact, mentioned, referred to and written in scripture. folks who deny that and tap dance around the fact with 'low alcohol' content or ir was only grape juice etc are defying logic. 
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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Posts: 24285
11/29/16 9:00 pm
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Cojak |
I guess it is time for the age old Alcohol. coffee, and legal medications Thread.
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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Posts: 24285
11/29/16 9:01 pm
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Ernie Long |
| Cojak wrote: | | I guess it is time for the age old Alcohol. coffee, and legal medications Thread. |
I hope not Cojac, I rather this be a conversation of how people view sin.
The reason for some things that are on the list as i.e. over eating and refusing to work aren't considered sins, but we lump them in the mix to cause confusion on what is sin that separates people from Christ.
And yes, if you have been on this forum for any period of time you have seen arguments for or against drinking. So, instead of making our cases for or against drinking, insert any thing that is consider to be sin to some and not others and let's see where the conversation leads.
Is shooting up heroin worst than drinking? Don't both serve the same purpose?
Is lying worst than cheating on one's taxes? Isn't both about doing something for personal gain?
Is looking at porn worst than flirting? Can't both lead to hurt and pain? |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1050
11/30/16 8:41 am
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| Re: Can someone actively |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| Ernie Long wrote: | be doing any of the following and be a Christian?
Drink to relax |
What ifn ya drink fer ya oft infirmities? |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15570
11/30/16 9:18 am
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| Re: Can someone actively |
Ernie Long |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Ernie Long wrote: | be doing any of the following and be a Christian?
Drink to relax |
What ifn ya drink fer ya oft infirmities? |
Naw, nowadays you smoke a little dope for what ails you |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1050
11/30/16 11:06 am
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| Re: Can someone actively |
Link |
| Ernie Long wrote: | | Link wrote: | You'd need to explain a bit about 'drink to relax' to make it a sin. How about relaxing with a cup of coffee, is that a sin? Why would it be wrong to do the same thing with one cup of win? How about a low alcohol beer?
When Jesus drank wine, did He ever relax a bit? What about the apostles? They weren't standing up at the Lord's Supper.
There are times it is appropriate to refuse to work. There is a Proverb against working too much too. |
Hey Link, if you need liquor to relax, more power to you. Do you know for a fact that Jesus drank wine to relax? I only read where they drank wine with their meals, for an upset stomach, and while they was partying, but I'm sure someone has wrote somewhere that Jesus drank wine while cruising the seas, cause He was telling them, "Let's go over to the other side" quite often. |
Well, I thought we were talking about wine and not liquor. I've read that John Wesley drank wine, but preached strongly against the use of distilled liquors. That evolved into the modern Pentecostal teaching of no alcohol at all.
As far as drinking to relax, I gave the example of drinking coffee to relax. A lot of people sit down and eat or drink something 'to relax' while enjoying the meal or drink. No intoxication has to be involved for that.
I'm a non-drinker. I did have a bit of red wine on a plane several months ago when I was flying in to China for a job interview and I had some kind of nasty throat infection forming that was causing me to lose my voice. It had the same effect as a good cough syrup. Fortunately, the people who picked me up let me stop at a drug store where I was able to buy a full course of amoxillin for about $5 without a prescription. (Ten 500 mg pills were about 50 cents in Indonesia the last I checked.)
I've probably consumed a lot less alcohol, counting cough syrup, than most tee-totalers on this board.
_________________
Link |
Acts-perienced Poster
Posts: 11849
12/1/16 10:06 pm
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| Re: Can someone actively |
Methocostal |
Isn't relaxing with a cup of Caffine an oxymoron? I'd like one cup of "win" maybe it would work. I'll ship it to the Bronco's
I'm sorry, for me to poke fun of your typo is the pot calling the Kettle black
| Link wrote: | You'd need to explain a bit about 'drink to relax' to make it a sin. How about relaxing with a cup of coffee, is that a sin? Why would it be wrong to do the same thing with one cup of win? How about a low alcohol beer?
When Jesus drank wine, did He ever relax a bit? What about the apostles? They weren't standing up at the Lord's Supper.
There are times it is appropriate to refuse to work. There is a Proverb against working too much too. |
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Friendly Face
Posts: 496
12/2/16 4:26 pm
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Methocostal |
In all sincerity Cojak, you bet I would take pot for pain where it is legal. And no, I'm not advocating unlimited use of pot. I would vote for medical pot and I do know the downsides.
If the issue is "mind altering", then a lot of items needs added to the "list", including coffee. Goodness, some people seem to get "high" on sugar. Where does the list end?
I realize to some extent, that is exactly your point. But there is nothing more inherently worse about Pot than Nyquil.
| Cojak wrote: | Cheat on their spouse!
This would be pretty hard to do and it not be a sin, since it is listed as a SIN in scripture, That would be adultery, I think.
I really do not like lists. If we all made a list of the top 10 things GOD looks at as sin, we might have many different lists with about 4 being common. Just a guess.
If a Dr. Prescribes Valium most Christians would take it. If a Dr. Prescribes marijuana for pain, SOME Christians would use it.
If a Dr. prescribes a glass of wine before bed time, many Christians would follow the 'script'.
Lists get shaky. If you compare a list from 1952 and 2016 you would see a drastic change. Did God change? A list from 1952 would have been drastically different. It would contain TV, Movies, jewelry, make-up and bobbed hair at the top. |
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Friendly Face
Posts: 496
12/2/16 4:31 pm
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