Actscelerate.com

Bonnie

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1274 **3/10/16 4:01 pm**

If my use of the word "if" caused you to assume that I was blaming her then you assumed wrong.

It was initially in her power to choose not to put up with this and yes I was suggesting that she should have fought back but in no way blaming her. Unfortunately, this behavior was accepted during this time and It was the abuse, her misguided belief and the opinions of her so-called friends that she was supposed to endure this. This woman needed help on so many levels and those around her simply failed her.

Where in scripture does it say we are supposed to endure years of physical abuse????

If I were her friend or pastor, I would have told her to get out quickly and do whatever she needed to do to get out. Any pastor or person that tells an individual to stay in this should be arrested and thrown in jail. They are contributing to abuse just like the catholic priests were when they allowed those babies/adults to be molested.

Sometimes, the things we discuss on this board are very touchy subjects to some and for us to assume or pompously tell others they should endure things like this is simply wrong.

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 15570 **3/10/16 4:07 pm**

#advicefromPikeville

Any male, who is gonna beat up on his wife and make her black/blue/bruised, especially if he is claimin to speak fer the good Book, needs a gang a backslid deacons to take him out behind the wood shed. Now, don't kill him or nothin, an don't leave no evidence what can connect ya to the action. Let him know why this is happenin, that folk done seen the bruises on his wife an they know he is the culprit. Let him know that he is about to taste some a his own medicine, an if he ever lays a hand on her agin he might not live through the next whoopin. An then, light into the feller with kicks/punches. Make shore his face, nose, ears is gonna bruise. Break his arm, an a leg if ya have to. Then, call 911 an tell em some feller done fell off the roof a his wood shed.

Yes sir, he deserves ever bit of it.

#peaceinPikeville

Re: hmmmm

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1274 **3/10/16 4:10 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 4:10 pm**

OTCp

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1274 **3/10/16 4:13 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 4:16 pm**

Which of her beliefs were misguided?
What do you make of her words here:

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 4:22 pm**

When you say 'in accordance with the teaching of the New Testament,' you might as well tack on the phrase 'as interpreted by complementarians.'
I have indeed heard a testimony of an abusive husband who changed. I have also heard of more situations where women were expected to stay with someone in vain hopes that he would change. And unfortunately, some churches have a horrible track record of believing abusers when they claim to have repented with no respect for past or potential future victims.

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1274 **3/10/16 4:29 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 4:36 pm**

Link, I did not say you were pro-abuse. I have insinuated you are black and white about the way you look at certain verses such as Ephesians 5:24. I don't think you really stop to consider how interpreting that in the literal, all believing women, all cultures, all time, black-and-white way practically plays out. Nor do I see evidence in what you write here on this forum that you have concerns about women who have been abused and who have been counseled to submit more as the solution to the abuse.
Do I think you would personally ever strike your wife. No, I cannot imagine you doing that.
So, I started to say, no, I don't think you are pro-abuse, but then you posted a scripture which (if your hermeneutic holds is for all believers in all cultures in all times) indicated that enduring abuse is praise worthy.
I guess the logical thing to say, then, is that one might recommend a person endure abuse, but not actually be pro-abuse? Oh, my, the hairs we split!!

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **3/10/16 4:36 pm**

When my grandfather was a young man in the 1940s, he found out that his brother-in-law had been coming home drunk at night and beating up his baby sister. Pawpaw got his sister a baseball bat, showed her how to properly knock a man out cold, told her to stand behind the door and wait for him to come home drunk, and to tell him when he woke up that there was more where that came from if he ever hit her again.

One treatment was all it took. The man even quit drinking and got saved. He never hit her again.

I wouldn't necessarily advocate such an approach in all cases, but sometimes all it takes is to stand up to a bully.

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 4:40 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **3/10/16 4:43 pm**

I would definitely say that if the woman felt her life or her children's safety were in jeopardy, separation would be justifiable, even necessary.

Truman Here

Hey, DOC Posts: 64 **3/10/16 6:52 pm**

now I haven't read all the pages and this may have been said by someone else . Where I came from , The deep South , we had a surefire way of sending a message to an abuser , Lite a cross like the KKK and put in the front yard making enough noise to make sure that person could and would see it , Put the gas soaked rags on a water soaked cross thereby leaving the remains of a burnt cross in the yard . If the person did not get the message to correct his meanness he would THEN GET THE MESSAGE , GOD BLESS . T

Acts-perienced Poster Posts: 11849 **3/10/16 7:02 pm**

Re: OTCp

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 15570 **3/10/16 7:04 pm**

Acts-perienced Poster Posts: 11849 **3/10/16 7:16 pm**

This is a bit different topic, but the woman in her Q&A downplays the issue of women who are violent toward men. A young healthy man may generally be a lot stronger than a woman. But I also correspondent with a man on a forum who was married to a woman who, based on his descriptions, seemed rather off-kilter and rather abusive. She'd wake him up yelling at him in addition to various forms of physical violence. If a woman is abusive, well, there are knives in the kitchen and a man's got to sleep sometime. Being with someone who is habitually abusive can be unsafe for either gender.

We also have to keep in mind that some people do have one-off experiences of violence in marriage, and it's not a constant thing. Then other things get labeled as 'abuse' besides physical violence. There are people who make their spouse's lives miserable by insulting, fault-finding, and threats.

And some of the models feminists have put together to define abuse even include quoting Bible verses about submission, refusing to give a woman money when she wants it, or using male 'logic' as 'abusive' behaviors. Having a traditional Christian view of marriage makes a man out to be abusive by some of these models.

If the approach egalitarians take is 'Hey, look at this woman. Her husband quoted Ephesians 5 and beat her black and blue every day for 15 years' and then they argue for egalitarianism, that reminds me of something else. That reminds me of the gay rights advocates saying, 'Look at this poor kid who committed suicide because he was gay and came out of the closet and was bullied and his Fundamentalist parents didn't accept it.' and then trying to convince Christians to support gay rights or to change their interpretation of scripture to make gay okay because the kid killed himself.

The egalitarians can try to paint Christians with a traditional view of marriage as being pro-abuse. The gay rights advocates can try to paint people with a traditional view of marriage as being in favor of cruelty to teenagers who struggle with same-sex identity.

I suppose if I responded to someone with an agenda to promote homosexuality by telling about teens who killed themselves on the forum by pointing out the homosexual behavior was sinful, someone might accuse me of a lack of compassion for teens in that situation... maybe. But I'm not responding to the teen in this hypothetical scenario. I'm responding to the rhetorical approach to convincing the audience.

I don't want anyone to have a violent marriage. And of course I would have empathy for a woman whose husband beat her up, and I wouldn't want to see that with any of my relatives. But I just wonder if the topic here is being presented to endorse an 'egalitarian' view of marriage which basically says that wives don't really have to submit to their husbands.

Living in a culture where wives don't submit to their husbands, and where husbands don't lead or feel a sense of responsibility for the wife and family seems to go hand in hand. One problem enforces the other. It's all part of one system. A lot of husbands don't accept or realize the weight of responsibility that is on them to lead the family. I suspect this is one of the reasons for the divorce rate, and the cultural disdain for male leadership in the home, and wives submitting to that, just adds to the problem. My theory is that a lot of women can't handle not submitting to their husband. They don't want that. They've been taught feminism. But when the husband doesn't provide some leadership, it frustrates them. Society and culture says divorce is okay if they aren't 'in love', so they go out and file no-fault divorce, some percentage of them, the majority of which are filed by women in our society.

I'm sad to hear if this woman's husband beat her up. I don't know her or her husband. I don't know his side of the story, either, of course. A man shouldn't abuse his wife, and churches definitely shouldn't support or endorse preachers who live like this. Churches should discipline men like that. But her story doesn't change what the Bible teaches about marriage.

If a man loves his wife like Christ loves the church, he's not going to abuse her.

If a couple did have a problem where the husband was abusive and they work out their problems and get back together, (after OTPCs proverbial deacons throw him off the woodshed) that doesn't mean the wife doesn't have to submit to her husband as the Bible teaches. If a counselor tells her to submit to her husband, that's not wrong. If someone thinks telling a wife to submit is a cure-all for a violent man who likes to hit people, that sounds rather foolish to me, and a potentially dangerous approach to counseling.
_________________
Link

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 7:49 pm**

I will answer your question with a question (as Jesus sometimes did).
Was God or Moses pro-divorce by the provision of a bill of divorcement?

Acts-perienced Poster Posts: 11849 **3/10/16 8:00 pm**

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1323 **3/10/16 8:02 pm**

Link
I find it odd every time this subject come ups and abuse is mentioned you to change the subject either by pointing out that women abuse men or that "abuse" is not always abuse.

Whether mental or physical it's still abuse and shouldn't be tolerated.

I've have friends that left an abusive relationship, both physical and drugs, only to be told by the church they needed to return to their spouse, because that was the spiritual thing to do.

The mans leadership in the house is not inviolate. Once they start down the road of abuse they have forfeit their right of leadership and any expectation that their wife should be submissive.

In addition, the Holy Spirit inspired Peter to say the things he did, however, the culture under the greco-roman world is not the same as today and neither was their form of slavery the same as our was in the 1800's.

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 15570 **3/10/16 8:15 pm**