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 Re: What would you do to improve MIP |
Don Bennett |
| Florida Bishop wrote: | It is so uncanny that MIP is a topic of discussion on Actscelerate at this particular time.
Yesterday {Friday}, as the new Director of the Division of Education [being elected to the office of Second Assistant General Overseer]....I conducted the first full staff meeting with the entire DOE family, which includes the Coordinators of CIMS, CAMS, and MIP.
What is uncanny is that I began the meeting by making this statement: "There are three questions that we must always be asking ourselves....
First: What is the 'perception' of our work by the people we serve outside of Cleveland, Tennessee"?
Second: what changes need to be made in MIP?... Why? How? When?
Third: How can the Division of Education serve the local church in new and significant ways?"
I believe now, as I always have, that the International Offices, as well as our State/Regional Offices "exist" for the sole purpose of serving the local church! This is our purpose for being!
Late last night I decided to see what was being discussed on Actscelerate, and to my amazement it was MIP. I immediately emailed several people on our DOE leadership team, and asked them to login...
We are reading your posts...the concerns of the people we serve are important to us and will be taken seriously.
Please, be mindful that some things concerning Licensure and Ministerial Training are "mandated" by our highest governing body, the General Assembly. While there may be flexibility in some things... the directives of the General Assembly are the bottom line.
Also, the Division of Education, like all Divisions and Departments in the International Offices are operating on declining underwriting from the Tithe Fund. The reality is that each local church is keeping more of the tithe and sending less to fund State and International services...
And, likewise... the leadership in each state/region also have reducing incomes which impact the delivery system of MIP.
Thank you for your input, and allowing me the privilege of serving you!
Bishop Stephens and I have discussed some of the facets and ways to look at MIP. He suggested that I share with you the following.
Ministerial Development/School of Ministry (MDSOM) has recently utilized Skype for conducting MIP seminars.
Wade Miller, the MIP coordinator for the Ministry to the Military in Europe, coordinated the MIP in Europe this past term (2011-2012). Because of the distance between the MIP candidates, Wade conducted the seminars using Skype
MDSOM has talked with state ministerial training leaders, especially where there is a great distance for the MIP candidates to travel, about using Skype.
Also, MDSOM has on its “to-do list” to research making electronic copies of the textbooks and study guides available. With the assistance of Pathway, the Church of God Minutes were available electronically for the CAMS applicants this past year.
In addition, specializations are offered in the MIP. The specializations available are (1) assistant pastor ministry, (2) chaplaincy, (3) children’s ministry, (4) Christian education, (5) church planting, and (6) youth ministry. An MIP candidate can request to participate in one of these specializations as part of the supervised practicum.
These are some of the ways that the MIP is trying to train our new ministers.
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Newbie
Posts: 2
9/11/12 6:55 pm
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| Hmmm... |
Rafael D Martinez |
| roughridercog wrote: | | If the candidate completed a degree in Bible or pastoral ministries from Lee the MIP should be waived. |
... I have been in ministry since 1983, I've earned a degree from Lee in 1991 and double majored in Biblical Ed and Christian Ed, and have carried exhorter credentials since 1992 and Rough, you say the requirements would be that I'd still need to do the MIP before I can get ordained?
That's not what every Lee professor I ever asked about told me. I was told that if I held an earned degree from Lee, the MIP requirement WOULD be waived.
I've held exhorters since 1992 and am looking forward to an imminent future in which I'll be in active associate or pastoral ministry in Chicago .. at which time I'll be seeking to be ordained.
But first I have to do the MIP? Is that what I'm hearing?
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Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth? Galatians 4:16
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Acts-dicted
Posts: 7766
9/11/12 9:09 pm
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| Re: Hmmm... |
mytimewillcome |
| Rafael D Martinez wrote: | | roughridercog wrote: | | If the candidate completed a degree in Bible or pastoral ministries from Lee the MIP should be waived. |
... I have been in ministry since 1983, I've earned a degree from Lee in 1991 and double majored in Biblical Ed and Christian Ed, and have carried exhorter credentials since 1992 and Rough, you say the requirements would be that I'd still need to do the MIP before I can get ordained?
That's not what every Lee professor I ever asked about told me. I was told that if I held an earned degree from Lee, the MIP requirement WOULD be waived.
I've held exhorters since 1992 and am looking forward to an imminent future in which I'll be in active associate or pastoral ministry in Chicago .. at which time I'll be seeking to be ordained.
But first I have to do the MIP? Is that what I'm hearing? |
Raf, you do NOT have to go through MIP.
The ministerial board of your state will waive it as long as you submit your transcripts with your application for ordination. |
Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3658
9/11/12 9:18 pm
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| Re: Hmmm... |
Clint Wills |
| Rafael D Martinez wrote: | | roughridercog wrote: | | If the candidate completed a degree in Bible or pastoral ministries from Lee the MIP should be waived. |
... I have been in ministry since 1983, I've earned a degree from Lee in 1991 and double majored in Biblical Ed and Christian Ed, and have carried exhorter credentials since 1992 and Rough, you say the requirements would be that I'd still need to do the MIP before I can get ordained?
That's not what every Lee professor I ever asked about told me. I was told that if I held an earned degree from Lee, the MIP requirement WOULD be waived.
I've held exhorters since 1992 and am looking forward to an imminent future in which I'll be in active associate or pastoral ministry in Chicago .. at which time I'll be seeking to be ordained.
But first I have to do the MIP? Is that what I'm hearing? |
Certainly in the cases where a candidate has been a pastor. However, I don't believe that any amount of education alone should get the MIP waived for you. The current status of MIP is really focused on classroom learning. I spent a day every month listening to guys talk about how to do this or that...almost ALL of which I had already learned from my supervising pastor. OT and NT survey stuff should be covered in CAMS. Let MIP be a Ministerial INTERNSHIP program. The company I work for hires interns. Those interns aren't doing homework in their off time. They are actually learning how to live in the business world. At the end they usually write an essay about their experience. Why can't we go to that model?? |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5161
9/12/12 4:01 pm
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PastorJackson |
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mytimewillcome |
| PastorJackson wrote: | | I was a Senior Pastor and when I got to the states I was not waived and had to go through MIP so there is no guarantee you will be waived. But Raf with your time and experience odd are you will be. |
Why would you assume you would be "waived" from going through MIP just because you were a senior pastor?
You can pastor a church at the exhorter level. That doesn't mean you are any more experienced than any other exhorter. |
Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3658
9/13/12 12:38 am
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PastorJackson |
Because the program can waiver you from going if you have been a senior pastor. Oh and yes it does, I learned a lot planting a church in Japan? | mytimewillcome wrote: | | PastorJackson wrote: | | I was a Senior Pastor and when I got to the states I was not waived and had to go through MIP so there is no guarantee you will be waived. But Raf with your time and experience odd are you will be. |
Why would you assume you would be "waived" from going through MIP just because you were a senior pastor?
You can pastor a church at the exhorter level. That doesn't mean you are any more experienced than any other exhorter. |
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Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia
Posts: 4743
9/13/12 12:46 am
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mytimewillcome |
| PastorJackson wrote: | | Because the program can waiver you from going if you have been a senior pastor. Oh and yes it does, I learned a lot planting a church in Japan? |
My MIP was full of those pastoring churches. Again, why should a senior pastor be exempt from going through MIP?
What church did you plant in Japan? |
Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3658
9/13/12 1:39 am
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| Re: MIP |
Bullseye77 |
A few years ago, I served as a "Master Pastor" in the MIP program. I was very closely involved in the progress of two students. One was a female, and I'm not sure she even had a high school diploma. The other was a bright college graduate. When testing time came, guess who scored highest on the test?
Going throught the material at that time, I noticed that the video lectures and the written text were exactly the same. You could read along while the lecturer spoke, word for word. The material was ok. But it was like the difference between coffee and hot water. I saw little in it at the time that would prepare someone for the real world of ministry. If I had been forced to go through the program, I would have died of boredom before ever completing it. I was not impressed with the program at that time and thought then that it was a waste of time and money. I hope it has been improved upon by this time. I am not being critical of the attempts made to improve and enhance ministry and ministers, but there has to be a better way. Just my opinion from five or six years ago. Maybe it's better now. I hope so.
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On Target!! |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1441
9/13/12 4:42 am
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| How to improve MIP? |
Florida Bishop |
I have read every post concerning MIP...Gained some thoughtful and helpful suggestions...really gives us positive ideas to pursue.
MIP is mandated by the General Assembly...our goal at the Division of Education is to improve the delivery system, content, and relativity for today's church. These are the areas of MIP that we are given oversight, and have some flexibility.
Those posting who have been through MIP, served as a Supervising Pastor, and/or otherwise "understand the purpose" of the program are very helpful. Keep them coming!
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J. DAVID [JIM] STEPHENS |
Member
Posts: 38
9/14/12 7:05 am
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| Through this thread... |
Clint Wills |
I think it's been awesome to read responses from Jim Stephens and Don Bennet. Getting on here and looking at responses to see how we can improve our systems. I appreciate the attitude of openness and conversation that we are able to have on this topic.
Many thanks to you two for opening the door from your end. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5161
9/14/12 10:56 am
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| Appreciation... |
Aaron Scott |
My ideas may or may not be of value. But I really appreciate someone at least listening. At least giving them a fair hearing.
Thank you, Bro. Stephens. It is that sort of willingness to publicly hear us that takes the wind out of the sails of disappointment, anger, and disillusionment.
I appreciate you listening. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6042
9/14/12 2:58 pm
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