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Acts-perienced Poster Posts: 11849 **3/10/16 1:06 pm**

II Peter 2 deals with cases of domestic violence. I say domestic violence because slaves were typically domestic servants... in the home.

In that chapter, Peter deals with slaves or servants, rather than wives. Does Peter advise submission/subjection for the abused in these verses?

18 Servants, be subject to your masters with all fear; not only to the good and gentle, but also to the froward.
19 For this is thankworthy, if a man for conscience toward God endure grief, suffering wrongfully.
20 For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.
21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:
22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
23 Who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered, he threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously:
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
_________________
Link

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 1:13 pm**

So does that mean your pro-abuse?

Re: hmmmm

Acts-perienced Poster Posts: 11849 **3/10/16 1:14 pm**

Acts-perienced Poster Posts: 11849 **3/10/16 1:15 pm**

Re: hmmmm

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 1:24 pm**

I appreciate that you decry what was done to her as evil. However, perhaps without realizing what you've said, you are blaming the victim for "putting up with it." The victim should not be blamed.
As Tucker mentions in her writings, she felt certain that people would not believe her. This was back in the 1980's. Case after case has borne out the reality of that fear. It does seem that the culturally climate is changing somewhat with respect to believing victims, but it is not hard to find cases still where a victim is blamed or not believed.
Another issue is custody. Tucker waited until her son was 13 and was old enough to testify to the abuse. She had feared that if she had taken it to court before that, she might have lost custody of her son.
And no, it is by no means certain the elders would have removed the man from his position. First, they might not have believed her. Second, they might have just told her to try being more submissive.
And in fact, after she separated, she agreed to go with her husband to "Biblical" counseling. That was indeed what she was advised to do--try being more submissive!!

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1323 **3/10/16 1:31 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 1:33 pm**

Ha! I just saw that I had your. I must have started out the sentence going somewhere else. I started to go back to correct it, but alas, you had already caught it for me. I would have caught it in time, but for how long it took me to type my response to Wayne. This HP keyboard cuts and pastes the last thing on the clipboard every time I use a quotation mark which means I have to delete everything every time I use a quotation mark. It is also pasting everything whenever I type a capital H. So when I type that, I have to type h, control z. Everything takes forever. Also the insert function has me totally befuddled. Part of the time it overwrites corrections, part of the time it inserts.
However, contrary to how I'm often portrayed here, I'm not the grammar police. But, if you want to play that game, I can be very annoying with it.

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 1:36 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 1:38 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 1:41 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 1:42 pm**

01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24285 **3/10/16 1:58 pm**

I am not sure if this can be explained to everyone's satisfaction. For some reason we have grown to 'accept' someone is in charge. Men and women have been taught the man is in charge. If not by word, by actions and obvious outward actions.

I am not sure if anyone on this forum have been married longer than my wife and I, in 5 months it will be 60 years and we were married as teenagers.

The last 35 years we have had one of the BEST marriages EVER. It took a few years for me to realize she was as important to OUR success as I. Even in my ignorant years I was not dumb enough to see myself as 'her disciplinarian'. And on the other hand she has never refused my desires nor I hers, if the circumstances allowed it.(You might have to work that statement out)

WE are and have been a team and to be honest I spend a lot of time now trying to make up for the stupid years she put up with me.

Once TRUE LOVE is realized you do not have a lot of time to be selfish nor demanding.

I knew a certain COG preachers wife most of my life and thought she was happy. When he died she confided he was a tyrant, mean, abusive. They were married 55 years before his death. She married a wonderful layman who treated her as a loving spouse. She told me that she was the happiest she had ever been, married to a good church member and Christian. Embarassed

_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
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http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 2:05 pm**

Cojak, I can't tell you how much I appreciate your posts. What you just did was what author Ruth Tucker wants to do--set aside the 'debate' and tell our stories.
Thanks.

Link and Bonnie

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1274 **3/10/16 2:25 pm**

Have either of you been victim to abuse? Were you raised in an environment where this went on?

bonnie

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1274 **3/10/16 2:26 pm**

Why does everything turn into a grammar lesson? Are you that perfect that you have to point out the imperfections of others?

Re: hmmmm

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1274 **3/10/16 2:45 pm**

[quote="bonnie knox"]I appreciate that you decry what was done to her as evil. However, perhaps without realizing what you've said, you are blaming the victim for "putting up with it." quote]

You never to cease to amaze with your assumptions. I feel sorry for this individual. I am sorry that she was in a "religious environment" that forced her to put up with this garbage. I am sorry that her 'Christian" husband thought it was his biblical duty to abuse his wife. I am sorry that her "Christian friends" didn't notice something was going on and then do something to assist her.

I assume by your response that you applaud her for staying in this abusive relationship? You think she did the right thing by allowing herself to endure multiple bouts of physical abuse?

"The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,"

Re: bonnie

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 3:24 pm**

No, the background goes way back to when Eddie started a thread about 'your/you're.'
It's like a running joke.
I was just pointing out to Link that I could, if I wanted to, be annoying about the grammar stuff. I get tired of the insinuation that I routinely point out the grammar errors I see. The only way I know to show that I don't do that is to give a taste of what it would look like if I did.

Re: hmmmm

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 14803 **3/10/16 3:33 pm**

I assumed nothing.
Wayne, you suggested she shouldn't have put up with it as if it were in her power to choose not to. You are suggesting that she could have stopped the abuse by fighting back.
What this says (whether intentionally or unintentionally) is that it is the victim's fault for not physically fighting back.