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Proposed Amendment Seeks Re-Structure of Elected Offices

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1815 **4/27/12 1:04 pm**

From Faith News

http://www.faithnews.cc/2012/04/27/proposed-amendment-seeks-re-structure-of-elected-offices/

Starting to shake things up!

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1302 **4/27/12 2:34 pm**

Good move, just not enough..

Friendly Face Posts: 117 **4/27/12 3:02 pm**

We will not be cutting ministry by eliminating these two positions. Ministry will continue right on with less bureacracy. Unless, the plan is just to appoint men to do the same thing. All we would be doing then is just to take away the right of the General Assembly to elect them.

If we really want to have more money for real ministry we should cut out many more elected and appointed positions in Cleveland. Just think how much more money we could have for national and international missions if we cut out 3 positions from the Executive Committee. That alone could provide around a half million dollars a year to be used for real ministry. Actually that would be much more when you eliminate their personal assistants, secretaries, retirement packages, cell phones, travel and housing allotments.

We are so top heavy on adminstration in the COG but no one at the top ever thinks about reducing the positions that cost us the most.

Walker & Allen, on the right track

Hey, DOC Posts: 54 **4/27/12 8:32 pm**

When we were preparing the Agenda for the upcoming Assembly, I understand, the council was trying to find cost cutting changes that would release more funds for World Evangelism. This is what I have been told. Now, it will be necessary for someone to do those jobs, Asst. World Missions and Asst. Youth Ministry but not at the cost as is now the case. Those positions can be appointed by the Committee with the same results at less cost.
Walker,you have it right, if the Second & Third Assistant Executive Committee position could be eliminated and Brother Wallace Sibley be brought to the 1st Assistant position we would save more than a half a Million dollars. An appointed position of Secretary General could take care of that job. Someone like Julian Robinson could easily do that work.
Wallace Sibley was an historical elected Committe person and if we say we are serious about putting the past racial history aside we will elect him to continue his service to the Church of God. He has done an amazing job of bridging the gap! The other Exe. Committee members say he is a pleasure to work with. Thank God for progress.

when

New Member Posts: 11 **4/27/12 11:46 pm**

After reading this information does anyone know when this is proposed? It appears this will happen before we vote. I aint too smart on this stuff, but it says we will have a meeting at 200 order of the day if this passes.

I'm against the proposal because ... and a possible solution

Friendly Face Posts: 226 **4/28/12 6:43 am**

Friendly Face Posts: 254 **4/28/12 10:45 am**

I like the measure but I'm not sure it goes far enough. It seems to me that we should eliminate the 2 asst positions and 2 director positions. I like the the five GOs overseeing the five divisions as listed above.

The other option could be to elect the WM and Youth & Discipleship guy and eliminate two asst Go positions.

Seems like eliminating 4 elected officers would be better than 2 based on budgetary reasons.

Somebody please tell me why..

Friendly Face Posts: 117 **4/28/12 5:24 pm**

..we have so many executives in the Church of God. The Southern Baptist Convention has more than 16 million members in the US and they have one President and he also serves as the pastor of a local church.

We also have more executives than the Assemblies of God which has over 64 million members worldwide.

Does anyone other than our own executives think the Church of God would suffer with about half the General Officials?

Re: Somebody please tell me why..

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1302 **4/28/12 5:55 pm**

Restructure Proposed Amendment

Friendly Face Posts: 484 **4/28/12 7:39 pm**

This is the way I ubderstand it. It's not about removing the Assembly's right to vote people into key positions. Again, as I understand it the recommendation at least relative to WM Assistant Dir. was part of a report given to the Coucil of 18 that was comprised of 3 WM Board, 4 Members of Coucil of 18 , 2 WM area Superintendents, 2 WM Field Dir., 2 State Overseers and 4 Pastors. They are not recommending that others be appointed to do the jhob of the Assistant WM Dir., but that the work be distributed to Field Directors or Interdepartmental personnel who are already in place. As with the tithe fund , a major reduction is taking place with WM. I am told they are reducing the basic budget down to 51/2 million over the next three years. This is from a high of over 13 million a few years ago. I understand that discounting the operation of these two offices will save well over 1.2 million over 4 years. This also comes at a time when tenures are completed. To wait until 2016 to implement this is not good stewardship in light of the missional hinderance and finacial burden it would contribute to. However, just a thought to look at and consider!

Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia Posts: 4804 **4/29/12 10:20 pm**

If this is all that's on the agenda, then it seems like you guys are gonna have a great time at Disney World!
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That's Not All That's On There

Acts-celerater Posts: 813 **4/30/12 8:05 am**

but because it dealt with the by-laws then previous notice had to be sent out, i believe within sixty days.

My question is can this item be amended to include other positions, or because it is by-law related are we limited to only these two positions?

Friendly Face Posts: 135 **4/30/12 11:24 am**

Will there be any better time than this General Assembly to abolish two positions from the General Executive Committee since two top executive's tenure is up this year? But I am sure there will be "rules and regulations" that will forbid any such thing even being discussed. If our church is in such financial need that we cannot continue our fulfillment of the Great Commission, how can we justify the great expense of all five men, albeit I respect and honor the leadership of all our elected officials now serving.

Two Salaries Eliminated?

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1270 **5/1/12 10:20 am**

In the letter to ordained ministers explaining the reasoning behind eliminating these 2 positions it states that it "will save $408,000 annually".

Does that mean that each of these men were making $204,000 a year?
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Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16509 **5/1/12 10:25 am**

When you consider insurance, administrative support, pension, any taxes that are involved and travel expenses, I am surprised it is that little.

I'm Sure That's Not What They Were Making

Acts-celerater Posts: 813 **5/1/12 12:25 pm**

Rather what their office cost us. That would include salary & benefits for the positions, salary & benefits for their secretary, office costs, travel costs, etc. etc. etc

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 5161 **5/1/12 1:39 pm**

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1270 **5/1/12 2:19 pm**

Compare it to what Billy Graham takes as a salary.
I have always strongly respected him. I don't remember what it was but he set up his association to avoid the trap so many fall under of "filthy lucre" and set a board in control and took a very minimum salary for himself, modest home. I don't know, but I will just about bet he doesn't drive a BMW or Mercedes or Rolls.

I lived in Cleveland before, and I don't think I've seen that many luxury cars parked in a lot (outside of a dealer) than what I saw parked at headquarters but that was years ago.

I think our system has made several millionaires who own multiple properties around the area while so many local pastors are on food stamps and have no health insurance.
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Administrator Post

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1270 **5/1/12 2:25 pm**

Where is that good post someone made concerning how the COG has way more administrators than the A/G which has like 10 times more the membership size than the COG? And the Southern Baptists whose top man is also a local pastor?
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Ichtus77

Friendly Face Posts: 219 **5/1/12 2:32 pm**

Would your respect of Billy Graham change if you knew he drove a BMW. If so, you don't have respect for him.