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Travis Johnson |
| chainrattler wrote: | | Travis Johnson wrote: | | You should do that as a life plan. Your kids and wife will love you for it. |
And that is part of the problem, right there.
You young kids have come to expect a comfortable, middle-class American standard of living as your right in this world, even if you're in the ministry.
Do you realize that the standard of living that we have enjoyed for the last 67 years in this country is an anomaly in comparison to world history?
That 67 years of post-WW2 prosperity (that only 6% of the world's population has gotten to enjoy) represents only 3.33% of world history in the last 2012 years? For 96.7% of the time since Jesus came to earth, such prosperity was unknown to all but a miniscule part of the population (saved or unsaved).
Those same 67 years only represent 28.3% of the total time the United States has existed as a nation. For 71.7% of our nation's history (almost 3/4) such prosperity has been unknown, and now it is expected as the norm?
So the norm has been lack, and survival skills, and gratitude for a morsel of bread and a cup of clean water for over 6,000,000,000 people for over 20 centuries.
But today we expect a cushy lifestyle as our right, while others around us suffer. |
No one said anything about standard of living. |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 7821
3/5/12 7:34 pm
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| Re: Pastor's who teach the principle of the tithe |
Tracy S Hamilton |
| bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | Jack Hayford
Robert Morris
Brady Boyd
Stovall Weems
Joel Osteen
Craig Groeschel
Andy Stanley - the blessing of being a percentage giver (tither)
Loran Livingston
Jentezen Franklin
Ed Young Sr.
Ed Young Jr.
Charles Blake
Bob Coy
Kerry Shook
Dave Stone
T.D. Jakes
Joe Champion
Creflo Dollar
Chuck Smith
Greg Surratt
Tommy Barnett
Jimmy Evans
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these men are pretty sound doctrinally and all teach on tithing. Surely that can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Others who do not teach the principle of the tithe:
Paul
Peter
James
John
Barnabas
The Holy Ghost - Acts 15:28,29
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these are pretty sound doctrinally and none teach on NT tithing. Surely they can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate.  |
Opinion..... plain and simple..... we all know that you have one as do others. I don't think they had to preach something that was apparently the norm. Jesus said .... "this you ought to do." That seems like enough for me. I don't think the disciples would contradict Jesus. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2714
3/5/12 8:12 pm
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| The PRINCIPLE is fine... |
FloridaForever |
It is the REQUIREMENT that has been done away.
As I've said elsewhere, though I KNOW that God does not bless me above non-tithers, nor would He "curse" me beneath others if I stopped, I follow the PRINCIPLE of tithing because:
1) It's a good number to use. Not enough to break you, but enough to be of significance and demonstrate generosity.
2) It's a good example to set for other Christians. After all, the church does need our giving, and so do many important ministries.
3) As a member of the Church of God, even though I don't know of it being REQUIRED, it is expected.
4) Hey, I get to be a part of the GREATEST PROGRAM IN THE UNIVERSE: GOD'S KINGDOM!!! I get to help feed the hungry, shelter the orphans, bless those in need!!!! All for a measly 10% of my income, I get to connect up the King of Kings in what He is doing on Earth! WOW!!!
I do not believe, nor do I practice, giving ALL of my tithe to the local church, but I do give ALL my tithe to the work of God. It might be a widow in hard times, a retired minister who could use a boost, etc. For many years, I gave these only as offerings. But then I realized that I have no good reason for giving my tithes to the local church, but my offerings elsewhere. The SAME scripture that is used to demand that people bring their tithes to the "storehouse" (which is conveniently defined as your local church), also commands the same of offerings. So I conveniently ignore it and do what I KNOW in my heart to be right.
You should do the same! |
Golf Cart Mafia Soldier
Posts: 2295
3/5/12 8:57 pm
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| A pastor who would say |
Larry Wiley |
| Quote: | When you have pastor says that if he gives 10% and I give 9%, God will bless him but not me because I didn't give the 10, that's an issue.
Yes, I have heard this from a pastor |
I not a very wise pastor.
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Larry Wiley |
Acts Mod
Posts: 5298
3/5/12 9:25 pm
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chainrattler |
| Travis Johnson wrote: |
No one said anything about standard of living. |
That is exactly the impact of your response to the statement:
| Quote: | For years pastors visited the sick and shut in without the benefit of it being a full time job. When I was growing up there weren't any full time salaried pastors and yet they got the job done.
You should do that as a life plan. Your kids and wife will love you for it. |
Being bivocational does impact your standard of living. |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 975
3/5/12 9:33 pm
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| Re: I know I'm a broken record... |
theElder |
| Clint Wills wrote: | But one thing that nobody can argue with me about is that I have been faithful to tithe my entire adult life and God has ALWAYS taken care of every need - and even opened the flood gates for me.
Here's a testimony of why I tithe. Last May I was laid off from a job. I went the summer without work before signing on as a design contractor here in town. Now, in my second contract, in 10 months I will have made about 150% of what I have ever made in any 12 month period in my life.
I'm not saying that is because I tithe, but I'm not gonna find out how that may have gone differently if I didn't. |
Exactly, brother!
Whatever others believe or do to the contrary will not stop me and my family from tithing! |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1924
3/5/12 11:00 pm
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Travis Johnson |
| chainrattler wrote: | | Travis Johnson wrote: |
No one said anything about standard of living. |
That is exactly the impact of your response to the statement:
| Quote: | For years pastors visited the sick and shut in without the benefit of it being a full time job. When I was growing up there weren't any full time salaried pastors and yet they got the job done.
You should do that as a life plan. Your kids and wife will love you for it. |
Being bivocational does impact your standard of living. |
No. I had zero content addressing standard of living. In fact, when I was bivocational, my compensation was substantially higher than what it is in full-time ministry. But, my time was extremely limited. The model suggested as a life plan is unsustainable if you're going to honor your wife and children. |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 7821
3/5/12 11:16 pm
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| Re: Pastor's who teach the principle of the tithe |
bradfreeman |
| Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | Jack Hayford
Robert Morris
Brady Boyd
Stovall Weems
Joel Osteen
Craig Groeschel
Andy Stanley - the blessing of being a percentage giver (tither)
Loran Livingston
Jentezen Franklin
Ed Young Sr.
Ed Young Jr.
Charles Blake
Bob Coy
Kerry Shook
Dave Stone
T.D. Jakes
Joe Champion
Creflo Dollar
Chuck Smith
Greg Surratt
Tommy Barnett
Jimmy Evans
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these men are pretty sound doctrinally and all teach on tithing. Surely that can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Others who do not teach the principle of the tithe:
Paul
Peter
James
John
Barnabas
The Holy Ghost - Acts 15:28,29
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these are pretty sound doctrinally and none teach on NT tithing. Surely they can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Opinion..... plain and simple..... we all know that you have one as do others. I don't think they had to preach something that was apparently the norm. Jesus said .... "this you ought to do." That seems like enough for me. I don't think the disciples would contradict Jesus. |
It's not my opinion that Paul, Peter, James and John said nothing about a tithing requirement for NT believers.
It's also not my opinion that, in Matthew 23, Jesus was telling OT law-keepers that it was hypocritical of them to tithe on their spices and ignore much more important matters. He was not laying out a principle for NT believers anymore than He was in Matthew 23:1,2 when he told OT Jews they should do everything the leaders who "sit in the seat of Moses" tell them to. This command was also for OT Jews, not NT believers. The fact is, He was talking to OT Jews, living under the OT Law. I'm not reading anything into Matthew 23...just taking it at face value.
It is your opinion that Jesus commanded that we currently have to obey Jewish leaders who sit in the seat of Moses.
It's also not my opinion that Paul warned that keeping the Law in an attempt to get a blessing from God would bring a curse unless you keep the whole law. Gal. 3.
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
3/6/12 12:26 am
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| Re: Pastor's who teach the principle of the tithe |
Tracy S Hamilton |
| bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | Jack Hayford
Robert Morris
Brady Boyd
Stovall Weems
Joel Osteen
Craig Groeschel
Andy Stanley - the blessing of being a percentage giver (tither)
Loran Livingston
Jentezen Franklin
Ed Young Sr.
Ed Young Jr.
Charles Blake
Bob Coy
Kerry Shook
Dave Stone
T.D. Jakes
Joe Champion
Creflo Dollar
Chuck Smith
Greg Surratt
Tommy Barnett
Jimmy Evans
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these men are pretty sound doctrinally and all teach on tithing. Surely that can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Others who do not teach the principle of the tithe:
Paul
Peter
James
John
Barnabas
The Holy Ghost - Acts 15:28,29
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these are pretty sound doctrinally and none teach on NT tithing. Surely they can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Opinion..... plain and simple..... we all know that you have one as do others. I don't think they had to preach something that was apparently the norm. Jesus said .... "this you ought to do." That seems like enough for me. I don't think the disciples would contradict Jesus. |
It's not my opinion that Paul, Peter, James and John said nothing about a tithing requirement for NT believers.
It's also not my opinion that, in Matthew 23, Jesus was telling OT law-keepers that it was hypocritical of them to tithe on their spices and ignore much more important matters. He was not laying out a principle for NT believers anymore than He was in Matthew 23:1,2 when he told OT Jews they should do everything the leaders who "sit in the seat of Moses" tell them to. This command was also for OT Jews, not NT believers. The fact is, He was talking to OT Jews, living under the OT Law. I'm not reading anything into Matthew 23...just taking it at face value.
It is your opinion that Jesus commanded that we currently have to obey Jewish leaders who sit in the seat of Moses.
It's also not my opinion that Paul warned that keeping the Law in an attempt to get a blessing from God would bring a curse unless you keep the whole law. Gal. 3. |
Funny how God addressed the issue about returning to him..... it was about tithing and giving.... and then God himself said..... "I don't change."
And then people argue that apparently God changed or at least changed his mind. I guess God just mis-understood himself. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2714
3/6/12 11:46 am
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| Re: Pastor's who teach the principle of the tithe |
Resident Skeptic |
| Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | Jack Hayford
Robert Morris
Brady Boyd
Stovall Weems
Joel Osteen
Craig Groeschel
Andy Stanley - the blessing of being a percentage giver (tither)
Loran Livingston
Jentezen Franklin
Ed Young Sr.
Ed Young Jr.
Charles Blake
Bob Coy
Kerry Shook
Dave Stone
T.D. Jakes
Joe Champion
Creflo Dollar
Chuck Smith
Greg Surratt
Tommy Barnett
Jimmy Evans
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these men are pretty sound doctrinally and all teach on tithing. Surely that can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Others who do not teach the principle of the tithe:
Paul
Peter
James
John
Barnabas
The Holy Ghost - Acts 15:28,29
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these are pretty sound doctrinally and none teach on NT tithing. Surely they can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Opinion..... plain and simple..... we all know that you have one as do others. I don't think they had to preach something that was apparently the norm. Jesus said .... "this you ought to do." That seems like enough for me. I don't think the disciples would contradict Jesus. |
It's not my opinion that Paul, Peter, James and John said nothing about a tithing requirement for NT believers.
It's also not my opinion that, in Matthew 23, Jesus was telling OT law-keepers that it was hypocritical of them to tithe on their spices and ignore much more important matters. He was not laying out a principle for NT believers anymore than He was in Matthew 23:1,2 when he told OT Jews they should do everything the leaders who "sit in the seat of Moses" tell them to. This command was also for OT Jews, not NT believers. The fact is, He was talking to OT Jews, living under the OT Law. I'm not reading anything into Matthew 23...just taking it at face value.
It is your opinion that Jesus commanded that we currently have to obey Jewish leaders who sit in the seat of Moses.
It's also not my opinion that Paul warned that keeping the Law in an attempt to get a blessing from God would bring a curse unless you keep the whole law. Gal. 3. |
Funny how God addressed the issue about returning to him..... it was about tithing and giving.... and then God himself said..... "I don't change."
And then people argue that apparently God changed or at least changed his mind. I guess God just mis-understood himself. |
Funny how you think that if you keep repeating your hermeneutically flawed interpretation of that passage that it's true meaning will somehow change into what you want it to mean. |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/6/12 12:04 pm
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| Oh fer crying out loud... |
roughridercog |
If you wanna preach and believe tithing (I do), then do so. If you don't, then don't. That's pretty simple.
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Doctor of Bovinamodulation |
Acts Mod
Posts: 25305
3/6/12 2:07 pm
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| Re: Oh fer crying out loud... |
krista |
| roughridercog wrote: | | If you wanna preach and believe tithing (I do), then do so. If you don't, then don't. That's pretty simple. |
delete
Last edited by krista on 3/9/12 1:08 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
3/6/12 2:57 pm
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| Re: Pastor's who teach the principle of the tithe |
Tracy S Hamilton |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Tracy S Hamilton wrote: | Jack Hayford
Robert Morris
Brady Boyd
Stovall Weems
Joel Osteen
Craig Groeschel
Andy Stanley - the blessing of being a percentage giver (tither)
Loran Livingston
Jentezen Franklin
Ed Young Sr.
Ed Young Jr.
Charles Blake
Bob Coy
Kerry Shook
Dave Stone
T.D. Jakes
Joe Champion
Creflo Dollar
Chuck Smith
Greg Surratt
Tommy Barnett
Jimmy Evans
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these men are pretty sound doctrinally and all teach on tithing. Surely that can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Others who do not teach the principle of the tithe:
Paul
Peter
James
John
Barnabas
The Holy Ghost - Acts 15:28,29
The list could go on and on and on...... I think all of these are pretty sound doctrinally and none teach on NT tithing. Surely they can't all be wrong or maybe they just haven't read Actscelerate. |
Opinion..... plain and simple..... we all know that you have one as do others. I don't think they had to preach something that was apparently the norm. Jesus said .... "this you ought to do." That seems like enough for me. I don't think the disciples would contradict Jesus. |
It's not my opinion that Paul, Peter, James and John said nothing about a tithing requirement for NT believers.
It's also not my opinion that, in Matthew 23, Jesus was telling OT law-keepers that it was hypocritical of them to tithe on their spices and ignore much more important matters. He was not laying out a principle for NT believers anymore than He was in Matthew 23:1,2 when he told OT Jews they should do everything the leaders who "sit in the seat of Moses" tell them to. This command was also for OT Jews, not NT believers. The fact is, He was talking to OT Jews, living under the OT Law. I'm not reading anything into Matthew 23...just taking it at face value.
It is your opinion that Jesus commanded that we currently have to obey Jewish leaders who sit in the seat of Moses.
It's also not my opinion that Paul warned that keeping the Law in an attempt to get a blessing from God would bring a curse unless you keep the whole law. Gal. 3. |
Funny how God addressed the issue about returning to him..... it was about tithing and giving.... and then God himself said..... "I don't change."
And then people argue that apparently God changed or at least changed his mind. I guess God just mis-understood himself. |
Funny how you think that if you keep repeating your hermeneutically flawed interpretation of that passage that it's true meaning will somehow change into what you want it to mean. |
OK.... Resident.... I think we all know now that you are fascinated with the world hermeneutics..... lol We are all glad you can say and spell it.
There are different ways of dealing with hermeneutics..... it doesn't have to be the way that you see it..... lol |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2714
3/6/12 3:33 pm
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krista |
delete
Last edited by krista on 3/9/12 1:08 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
3/6/12 5:44 pm
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krista |
| Major B. Trammell wrote: | | krista wrote: |
Jesus had a perfect opportunity to teach that one need to not tithe any longer when he scolded the Pharisees. But He didn't. He said" to not leave the other undone". |
Krista, Jesus did not have the perfect opportunity to teach that one need not tithe when He scolded the Pharisees. At the time He spoke to the Pharisees in Matthew 23, the Law was still in effect.
Jesus stated that He did not come to destroy the Law, but to fulfill the Law and that not one jot or tittle would pass from the Law.... until all be fulfilled.
All was not fulfilled until His atonement on the cross.
If He had told those currently under the Law before his atonement that they need not tithe, He would have been doing away with the Law before it was fulfilled.
He told the Pharisees in Matthew 23 that they should not neglect the other matters of the Law. They were being hypocrites. They were practicing parts of the Law that could be observed in public (tithing) but were not following the Law when they weren't in plain sight of people (neglecting justice). They were putting on a show to make people believe they were righteous when they were not.
His statement was to a group of people who were at the time under the Law and the Law would remain until His atonement.
As for the 10%, 10% is a percentage. Of course, it is also a proportion as well. 10 is 10% of 100 just like 20 is 10% of 200. They are the same percentage, and each is the same proportion.
The difference is that a tithe is defined as 10%. That is set in stone. Under the New Covenant giving, Paul instructs each man to give "as he has purposed in his heart." So, under the New Covenant giving, one man's proportion may be bigger than another's or smaller than another's depending on what proportion he has decided to give in his heart, individually and in obedience to God. That proportion is not necessarily the same for each person, since each "purposes" in his own heart what to give. |
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Last edited by krista on 3/9/12 1:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
3/6/12 7:03 pm
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chainrattler |
| Travis Johnson wrote: | | chainrattler wrote: | | Travis Johnson wrote: |
No one said anything about standard of living. |
That is exactly the impact of your response to the statement:
| Quote: | For years pastors visited the sick and shut in without the benefit of it being a full time job. When I was growing up there weren't any full time salaried pastors and yet they got the job done.
You should do that as a life plan. Your kids and wife will love you for it. |
Being bivocational does impact your standard of living. |
No. I had zero content addressing standard of living. In fact, when I was bivocational, my compensation was substantially higher than what it is in full-time ministry. But, my time was extremely limited. The model suggested as a life plan is unsustainable if you're going to honor your wife and children. |
Standard of living is not limited to finances, as you pointed out just now. Time constraints count too. |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 975
3/6/12 7:47 pm
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krista |
| krista wrote: | | Major B. Trammell wrote: | | krista wrote: |
Jesus had a perfect opportunity to teach that one need to not tithe any longer when he scolded the Pharisees. But He didn't. He said" to not leave the other undone". |
Krista, Jesus did not have the perfect opportunity to teach that one need not tithe when He scolded the Pharisees. At the time He spoke to the Pharisees in Matthew 23, the Law was still in effect.
Jesus stated that He did not come to destroy the Law, but to fulfill the Law and that not one jot or tittle would pass from the Law.... until all be fulfilled.
All was not fulfilled until His atonement on the cross.
If He had told those currently under the Law before his atonement that they need not tithe, He would have been doing away with the Law before it was fulfilled.
He told the Pharisees in Matthew 23 that they should not neglect the other matters of the Law. They were being hypocrites. They were practicing parts of the Law that could be observed in public (tithing) but were not following the Law when they weren't in plain sight of people (neglecting justice). They were putting on a show to make people believe they were righteous when they were not.
His statement was to a group of people who were at the time under the Law and the Law would remain until His atonement.
As for the 10%, 10% is a percentage. Of course, it is also a proportion as well. 10 is 10% of 100 just like 20 is 10% of 200. They are the same percentage, and each is the same proportion.
The difference is that a tithe is defined as 10%. That is set in stone. Under the New Covenant giving, Paul instructs each man to give "as he has purposed in his heart." So, under the New Covenant giving, one man's proportion may be bigger than another's or smaller than another's depending on what proportion he has decided to give in his heart, individually and in obedience to God. That proportion is not necessarily the same for each person, since each "purposes" in his own heart what to give. |
Major, Then let's stop calling it tithes and stop paying the TOT. Just count it as offering. Or maybe you already do. 
If while Christ was alive the Law was totally still in tact, then how could Christ forgive sin? Wouldn't sin have been dealt with through animal sacrifice since the Law was still in effect? Wouldn't it have been out of order for Christ to forgive, since the system at hand was the Law? If His atonement ( Death) was the definite line that made the distinction of Law vs Grace, why would He forgive instead of directing one to offer up a sacrifice?
Also in 2 Corinthians 9, it is an offering being taken for the Church at Jerusalem and their needs. He was encouraging the Corinthians to purpose in their heart the gift they were going to give. To me, this was separated from the tithe. Like when we recieve a special offering at Church and people have to decide what to give. This was concerning a special offering, and not doctrine on weekly giving.
So we go back to proportion. The proportion I believe was the Tithe, because it was in proportion to what one had. |
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Last edited by krista on 3/9/12 1:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
3/6/12 9:02 pm
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Resident Skeptic |
| Quote: | | It's based proportionately, which would point us to the Tithe. The Tithe is exactly that. |
And yet you have nothing you can use in context that points you to a tithe. |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/6/12 9:27 pm
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Travis Johnson |
| chainrattler wrote: | | Standard of living is not limited to finances, as you pointed out just now. Time constraints count too. |
Definition of STANDARD OF LIVING (Merriam Webster)
1: the necessities, comforts, and luxuries enjoyed or aspired to by an individual or group
2: a minimum of necessities, comforts, or luxuries held essential to maintaining a person or group in customary or proper status or circumstances
When it comes to working bivocationally in a way that you are full-time outside of the church and completely available in the evenings to visit (as you suggested is an appropriate way of ministry life), is an unacceptable plan for ministry and family health for me...and I'd advise against it for others as well.
I'm not saying bivocational ministry is unacceptable. It's actually good and beautiful. But, this model of a professional pastor who is underpaid while maintaining all of the responsibilities of a professional do-er is devastating for family health...and it avoids the calling of a pastor to equip saints for works of service.
If I had to choose between pastoral ministry and a healthy, functional life with my family, I'd choose my family in a heartbeat. My wife and my children are only second to myself in terms of ministry responsibility. I treasure them...and would rather they know the grace of Jesus than anyone else on the planet. I wouldn't trade their destinies for the care of strangers who will never realize the extent of the sacrifice made for their occasional care.
And, I won't have them hating Jesus because of the way I stewarded my time. |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 7821
3/6/12 9:34 pm
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skinnybishop |
| Travis Johnson wrote: | | chainrattler wrote: | | Standard of living is not limited to finances, as you pointed out just now. Time constraints count too. |
Definition of STANDARD OF LIVING (Merriam Webster)
1: the necessities, comforts, and luxuries enjoyed or aspired to by an individual or group
2: a minimum of necessities, comforts, or luxuries held essential to maintaining a person or group in customary or proper status or circumstances
When it comes to working bivocationally in a way that you are full-time outside of the church and completely available in the evenings to visit (as you suggested is an appropriate way of ministry life), is an unacceptable plan for ministry and family health for me...and I'd advise against it for others as well.
I'm not saying bivocational ministry is unacceptable. It's actually good and beautiful. But, this model of a professional pastor who is underpaid while maintaining all of the responsibilities of a professional do-er is devastating for family health...and it avoids the calling of a pastor to equip saints for works of service.
If I had to choose between pastoral ministry and a healthy, functional life with my family, I'd choose my family in a heartbeat. My wife and my children are only second to myself in terms of ministry responsibility. I treasure them...and would rather they know the grace of Jesus than anyone else on the planet. I wouldn't trade their destinies for the care of strangers who will never realize the extent of the sacrifice made for their occasional care.
And, I won't have them hating Jesus because of the way I stewarded my time. |
Agree 100% Several years ago, I was a bivocational pastor. During that time I decided that I would not sacrifice my family on the altar of church growth. I think people confuse serving God with serving the Church. Two different things. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1055
3/6/12 10:10 pm
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