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Curtis Lowe II |
I thought I forgot to hit post.....and what do you know...I GOT A STICKY!!!!!!
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"you should've seen it in color"
"Don't taze me bro!" |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 902
1/13/12 10:00 pm
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| Re: Only mature, strong Christians should drink alcohol |
krista |
| Curtis Lowe II wrote: | OK. I'm going to stir things up a bit.
Perhaps the only people who should drink alcohol are mature strong Christians. It would seem to me those are the ones who have the wisdom and discipline have a drink, relax watch some football and them go to be with their own spouse.
While I am stirring...why do we always try to justify it as medicinal, why can't we just say it is relaxing and pleasurable. Is that sinful? Is it wrong to simply enjoy the relaxing feeling that some get from a glass of wine if we do not commit any sins? |
The question was asked in an earlier post about how to decide who is mature enough? The original post of this thread gives the maturity level of the poster. Curtis, You for sure should not drink as defined by your post. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/14/12 12:33 pm
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| Krista |
Cojak |
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| Re: Krista |
krista |
| Cojak wrote: | That ain't nice!   |
Didn't mean for it to be mean, I just found it as an amusing post.
BTW...1....one....uno...drink impairs judgement to some degree. It may be small, but it is a percentage.
For those who think it's ok. Just let some jerk with even the slightest blood alcohol ( Legally drunk or not) slam into your car and hurt your family, you'd be furious and you would right then change your mind.
Also, I've seen a lot of immature Christians drink, But I've never seen a strong mature Christian do so. So I guess if we follow Curtis' suggestion, then we have it backwards. That's funny!!! |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/14/12 12:56 pm
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| Krista... |
Curtis Lowe II |
I think the fact that you can't discuss issues without personally attacking and judging others proves who the immature christian is. 
I forgive you though because I used to be the same way before I grew up. 
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"you should've seen it in color"
"Don't taze me bro!" |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 902
1/14/12 1:21 pm
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| Re: Krista... |
krista |
| Curtis Lowe II wrote: | I think the fact that you can't discuss issues without personally attacking and judging others proves who the immature christian is.
I forgive you though because I used to be the same way before I grew up. |
You were in your original post trying to conclude who was mature and who was immature as far as who should drink alcohol. I see the issue as opposite than you and feel you were immature of your evaluation of this issue. Your post sounded like a 15 year old speaking. Sorry.
"Judging"? Isn't that what you were doing in the original? And aren't you now judging me. Beside that....get a haircut and pull up your pants. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/14/12 2:41 pm
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| Krista, I was posing |
Curtis Lowe II |
a question for discussion. I also said I was stirring the pot. I wasn't making judgments or stating my opinion.
I would like to compliment your ability to"Crawfish" though. 
Oh and I still believe the mullet will make a comeback and spandex pants should never be forcibly pulled up too high.
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"you should've seen it in color"
"Don't taze me bro!" |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 902
1/14/12 3:35 pm
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| Re: Only mature, strong Christians should drink alcohol |
krista |
| Curtis Lowe II wrote: | OK. I'm going to stir things up a bit.
Perhaps the only people who should drink alcohol are mature strong Christians. It would seem to me those are the ones who have the wisdom and discipline have a drink, relax watch some football and them go to be with their own spouse.
While I am stirring...why do we always try to justify it as medicinal, why can't we just say it is relaxing and pleasurable. Is that sinful? Is it wrong to simply enjoy the relaxing feeling that some get from a glass of wine if we do not commit any sins? |
While you say you're stirring the pot, it is very clear you are suggesting these principles. "It would seem to me"......that's not stirring....that's dipping out of the pot. " Is that sinful? Is it wrong to simply enjoy the relaxing feeling that some get from a glass of wine if we do not commit any sins? That's not stirring, it's a retorical question with the intent to suggest. So you can accuse me of crawfishing, but it's clear what you're getting to.
Also...that's not a mullet. It's just long hair. Hey! I hear your momma calling. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/14/12 3:58 pm
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| Krista, again... |
Curtis Lowe II |
you try to tell me what I am saying. There you go again judging people.
If you are actually God please have mercy on me for having very little patience with judgmental arrogant mean spirited people and if you are not then please wait until you are out of junior high to post on a message board intended for adults. 
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"you should've seen it in color"
"Don't taze me bro!" |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 902
1/14/12 5:04 pm
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| Re: Krista, again... |
krista |
| Curtis Lowe II wrote: | you try to tell me what I am saying. There you go again judging people.
If you are actually God please have mercy on me for having very little patience with judgmental arrogant mean spirited people and if you are not then please wait until you are out of junior high to post on a message board intended for adults. |
Come on Curtis. Fess up. You know the way the game is played. You know what you were up to, so don't give this victim mentality. You are no different than me. You have strong convictions. Guys like you post garbage and then you play the Pious / self-righteous game when someone objects. That stuff doesn't work with me.
1. Your post said what you were thinking. You know what you were wanting to say. You just formed it as a question.
2. You have been on Acts long enough to know what a thread like this response is going to be. You were looking for it.
3. Grow up and put you big boy pants on. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/14/12 5:40 pm
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| Re: ok I am going to stir the pot a little |
krista |
| bradfreeman wrote: | | Poimen wrote: | | Perhaps because, apart from medicinal value, drinking enough to relax and find pleasure in the drink is too much? |
Yes, because we all know that relaxing and finding pleasure are prohibited for the Christian.
| Quote: | | Perhaps that is the starting point of being drunk, impaired by the alcohol (even if the impairment seems positive)? Worth considering at least, since we know no drunkard can inherit the Kingdom of God. |
"Impairment", hmmm. Jesus said it was what came out of a man that defiled him. So the real questions are twofold:
1. Does the drink cause me to sin?
2. Does the drink master me?
3. Does drinking in certain circles cause someone to stumble?
If you can answer no to both, then bottom's up! |
This is a joke..............right? If it's not you need to lay off the Captain Morgan. Put you foot down and say "NO" to alcohol! |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/14/12 5:50 pm
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| Krista |
Curtis Lowe II |
Honestly??? All I have left to say to you is:
Proverbs 26:4
King James Version (KJV)
4Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.
I won't be answering you again on the post.
_________________
"you should've seen it in color"
"Don't taze me bro!" |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 902
1/14/12 6:07 pm
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| Re: Krista |
krista |
| Curtis Lowe II wrote: | Honestly??? All I have left to say to you is:
Proverbs 26:4
King James Version (KJV)
4Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.
I won't be answering you again on the post. |
Again....your pious / self-righteous mentality.
According to your Scripture you posted I regret having answered your "trick" question. We know who the "fool" is here. And self-righteous. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/14/12 6:26 pm
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| Here we go again |
Purplebarney |
We're always going to be divided on this issue but I'll give you my opinion.
1. The United States is the only country I've been to where alcohol is such a divisive topic (I'm talking about COG folks). For example, if you go to Germany and were to go out with most pastors you will find that they will drink beer. Its a part of their culture. The same goes for the UK, Australia, New Zealand, France (wine), etc.....Its really a non-issue. So, were the scriptures only written for the US based church when people want to say alcohol is a sin? Just wondering. What about Nyquil? Its got 10% alcohol. Hey, alcohol is alcohol right? I mean, the Nyquil back in the days of Jesus is the same Nyquil we have today right? ha!
2. I heard Donnie Swaggart (yes, I'm quoting DS! yikes!!) say "I'm just gonna say it, if you're a pastor, Sunday school teacher, laymen, or just a normal every day Christian and you drink your beer or wine you are going straight to hell!" Yes, Donnie said that! How blinded he is!
Moderation is the key and what I think the original post was meaning was that if you cannot make yourself stop drinking before you get to the point of drunkeness then yes, you need to abstain until you are mature enough to know when to say when. As for the relaxing feeling.....why can't Christians experience the relaxation of a nice glass of Red wine? For those of us who drink on occasion I can admit that one of the reasons I do drink is to relax after a stressful day. Maybe that doesn't work with you but to quote myself...."you ain't me!' I'll see y'all in Heaven! (yes, even you Donnie...that is if you're heart is right) |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 704
1/14/12 11:08 pm
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Eddie Robbins |
| Serious question....are the COG members/ministers in other countries not under the same rules? |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16509
1/14/12 11:24 pm
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| For the sake of discussion, digging deeper here ... |
Poimen |
Krista,
I think my position regarding alcohol consumption and believers is pretty infamous around here. I am NOT for alcohol, nor do I think we often understand it biblically in it's historical context and everyday use. Without which I think we inadvertently become more accepting of modern notions of moderation than we should. That is my opinion. However, drunkenness is no doubt a sin, and one which will keep a man or woman out of heaven. So it's a serious subject well enough.
That said ...
I find your designation above, of strong vs weak, interesting. I assume it is predicated on Paul's use of such designations when discussing "meat and drink" issues in Romans 14, and in 1 Corinthians 8 as well. If so I am curious how you maintain your position that those who partake of alcohol in moderation are the weak, and not the strong?
Romans 14:2 seems clear that it is the abstainer that is weak. No?
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Poimen
Bro. Christopher
Singing: "Let us then be true and faithful -- trusting, serving, everyday. Just one glimpse of Him in glory will the toils of life repay." |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5657
1/15/12 12:44 am
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| Re: For the sake of discussion, digging deeper here ... |
mytimewillcome |
| Poimen wrote: | | I am NOT for alcohol, nor do I think we often understand it biblically in it's historical context and everyday use. Without which I think we inadvertently become more accepting of modern notions of moderation than we should. |
"Modern notions"? Surely you realize that abstinence is only a recent theological stance, mainly influenced by Prohibition in the 1920's.
History would not agree your position as congruent with core Christian teaching. |
Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3658
1/15/12 10:18 am
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| Re: For the sake of discussion, digging deeper here ... |
krista |
| Poimen wrote: | Krista,
I think my position regarding alcohol consumption and believers is pretty infamous around here. I am NOT for alcohol, nor do I think we often understand it biblically in it's historical context and everyday use. Without which I think we inadvertently become more accepting of modern notions of moderation than we should. That is my opinion. However, drunkenness is no doubt a sin, and one which will keep a man or woman out of heaven. So it's a serious subject well enough.
That said ...
I find your designation above, of strong vs weak, interesting. I assume it is predicated on Paul's use of such designations when discussing "meat and drink" issues in Romans 14, and in 1 Corinthians 8 as well. If so I am curious how you maintain your position that those who partake of alcohol in moderation are the weak, and not the strong?
Romans 14:2 seems clear that it is the abstainer that is weak. No? |
Poimen, you are one of those on Acts I respect. I understand you are very knowlegable in the Word and I would never take you on.
With that said, I think you said it right "nor do I think we often understand it biblically in it's historical context and everyday use".I believe there is something we have missed with this alcohol issue. I say that because I am not new to Christian living and have seen a lot. And it is my observation that it is always those who are "Weak' that drink alcohol. I have never seen a strong, mature Christian who consumed alcohol.
Your Scriptures, to be honest, I can not explain. But I am not convinced it is the same issue we are talking bout on this thread.
Also, the ones on here who do condone and teach that drinking alcohol is ok, they seem quick to slam those of us who believe other-wise. |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2960
1/15/12 4:36 pm
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| Re: For the sake of discussion, digging deeper here ... |
Poimen |
| mytimewillcome wrote: | | Poimen wrote: | | I am NOT for alcohol, nor do I think we often understand it biblically in it's historical context and everyday use. Without which I think we inadvertently become more accepting of modern notions of moderation than we should. |
"Modern notions"? Surely you realize that abstinence is only a recent theological stance, mainly influenced by Prohibition in the 1920's.
History would not agree your position as congruent with core Christian teaching. |
My emphasis is on modern notions of moderation, not necessarily abstinence. It's virtually an overlooked or forgotten aspect of ancient customs regarding preservation, fermentation, concentration, etc. But that's likely a thread of it's own.
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Poimen
Bro. Christopher
Singing: "Let us then be true and faithful -- trusting, serving, everyday. Just one glimpse of Him in glory will the toils of life repay." |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5657
1/15/12 5:02 pm
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| Krista..... |
Purplebarney |
| I'm a strong, mature Christian who consumes two glasses of Red wine with my meal. Not every day. I can go weeks without it. However, I do consume it and keep bottles in my household for personal consumption. I'm not addicted to it nor does it control me. I love the Lord and know He loves me. I have not one ounce of doubt in my mind that because I do this that I'm going to hell. I'm very confident in my relationship with Christ! So, I guess I'm the first strong, mature Christian that you know who drinks alcohol. |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 704
1/15/12 5:33 pm
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