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Associate Churches...

Acts-celerater Posts: 841 **9/14/11 4:07 pm**

To keep from hijacking another thread on Church plants, I wanted to respond in a new thread.

Associate Churches

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1449 **9/14/11 8:01 pm**

I am also for associate churches. The church of God is turning out more ministers in its MIP program and @ Lee University than is needed in most states. Associate churches would give some of these ministers a place to pastor.

Current minutes states "Be it further resolved that we do not approve our ministers pastoring or otherwise asisting such independent congregations, and declare that ministers who persist in doing so are out of harmony with our stated policy of centralized government; and appropriate action should be initiated by proper authorities against offending ministers." Also "Be it therefore resolved that the International General Assembly does not recognize or approve the practice of our ministers setting up independent congregations who do not suscribe to the doctrines, faith, practices, teachings, and government of the Church of God."

I know of the Free Chapel situation. It is against what the current minutes state, and high COG officials would like to get the associate church issue passed so it would get some of the pressure off them to do something about it.

I predict that the OB's will not approve the Associate Church at the GA next year. I would like to hear from some of the OB's on their view.

01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24285 **9/14/11 8:33 pm**

I have no problem with 'associate churches' from my view from the pew.

I do however have a problem with everyone not following the same rules as to who can pastor and who cannot..
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
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http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/

Acts Mod Posts: 5298 **9/14/11 9:13 pm**

I agree with Cojak. I have no problem with associate churches, I do have a problem with double standards.

I love Jentezen and hope him the very best. Glad he has had the opportunity in S. Ca. Heard him say the church is now running 4K.
_________________
Larry Wiley

Cojak and LArry

Friendly Face Posts: 441 **9/14/11 9:35 pm**

If it advances the Kingdom why do we fell so slighted? To me "it's not fair" is not a good excuse. What advances the kingdom should be the issue.
(I do not say this abrasively, just clarifying because that statement could be interpreted to be harsh)
_________________
Once I thought was wrong, but...I was mistaken

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **9/14/11 9:40 pm**

If they allow associate churches (which I personally would be fine with too), then they would in due course also have to decentralize and let ALL local churches own their own property, have their own local board, hire and fire their own pastors, etc. (which I personally would not be fine with), or else they must come up with some kind of two-tiered set-up of churches, where some are full members and some are associate members.

Turn About Is Fair Play

Acts-celerater Posts: 854 **9/14/11 9:52 pm**

If an independant church can become an associate church, can a denominational church become an associate church? Shouldn't that pendulum swing both ways.
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Mark E. Hardgrove, D.Min., Ph.D.
Senior Pastor Conyers Church of God
http://www.conyerscog.org
Dean & VP for Academics at BHU
http://www.beulah.org/

Acts Mod Posts: 5298 **9/14/11 9:55 pm**

happened to me.

Acts-celerater Posts: 875 **9/14/11 10:41 pm**

I received a letter stating I had voluntarily surrendered my credentials when our church pulled out of the COG. that was good to know.
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John Stokes

Church | Facebook

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 7307 **9/15/11 7:27 am**

De-centralization is coming to the Church of God.

It's just a matter of time.

The Associate church concept is just too tempting to pass up.

Too many positives come with it.
_________________
Charles A. Hutchins
Senior Pastor SPWC
Congregational Church of God

www.spwc.church

Associate Churches

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1449 **9/15/11 10:08 am**

There are too many pastors in the COG that have the attitude that " the current system has been good to me" for them to vote yes on associate churches and decentralization of the COG. There is going to be a lot of fear discussed at the GA when this issue is presented.

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **9/15/11 3:43 pm**

I do know in the A/G and FSQ they used to have something like associate churches, where the ministers held credentials with the A/G or FSQ while pastoring nondenominational churches with the blessing of the denomination. Oftentimes these churches would participate in the world missions programs or other endeavors of the denomination, while still retaining their nondenominational status.

While the A/G is a lot more loosely organized than the CoG, the FSQ has a hierarchical form of government similar in many ways to the CoG.

Acts-dicted Posts: 7821 **9/15/11 4:33 pm**

If our goal is control, we should not allow associate churches because we have no way to MAKE them do what we want.

If our goal is mission cooperation, we should allow associate churches because we can compel people to WANT to participate with us in mission.

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **9/15/11 4:47 pm**

They would have to work out some kind of special associate status arrangement, but even still it will probably lead to total decentralization of the CoG, with local boards having hire-and-fire authority over pastors.

Having been a pastor in the A/G before and having plenty of friends and family who still are, I would not be in favor of the CoG adopting a congregational or modiified congregational form of gov't, though I suppose it probably does not matter what I think anyway.

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 7307 **9/15/11 7:59 pm**

Our church has operated with Congregational government since 1989.

With proper by-laws the Pastor and the members can enjoy security.

The by-laws are the key.
_________________
Charles A. Hutchins
Senior Pastor SPWC
Congregational Church of God

www.spwc.church

Acts-dicted Posts: 7821 **9/15/11 8:10 pm**

I know this is over-simplification, but...

Acts-celerater Posts: 841 **9/15/11 9:01 pm**

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **9/15/11 9:06 pm**

The associate churches thing didn't pass at the GA. There are a few irregular cases, but the issue is we need to have a regular policy for all, not special deals for some.

Elephant in the Room

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1449 **9/15/11 10:25 pm**

Rife states"the elephant is already in the room". The post by John Stokes doesn't look like he was in the room. Do you have other churches besides Free Chapel to help us understand that the elephant is "really" in the room? If you mentioned them in this forum would they end up like John Stokes?

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **9/15/11 10:29 pm**

If we're going to have associate churches or CoG ministers pastoring nondenominational churches I'm fine with that. We just need to amend the Minutes to reflect that.